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Facing Pages · Branch 30 of 44
Charmides · 168c–169a
Ancient Greek
p. 50Πολλὴ ἀνάγκη, ἔφη, ὦ Σώκρατες.
Οὐκοῦν καὶ εἴ τι διπλάσιόν ἐστιν τῶν τε ἄλλων διπλασίων καὶ ἑαυτοῦ, ἡμίσεος δήπου ὄντος ἑαυτοῦ τε καὶ τῶν ἄλλων διπλάσιον ἂν εἴη· οὐ γάρ ἐστίν που ἄλλου διπλάσιον ἢ ἡμίσεος.
Ἀληθῆ.
Πλέον δὲ αὑτοῦ ὂν οὐ καὶ ἔλαττον ἔσται, καὶ βαρύτερον ὂν κουφότερον, καὶ πρεσβύτερον ὂν νεώτερον, καὶ τἆλλα 168d πάντα ὡσαύτως, ὅτιπερ ἂν τὴν ἑαυτοῦ δύναμιν πρὸς ἑαυτὸ ἔχῃ, οὐ καὶ ἐκείνην ἕξει τὴν οὐσίαν, πρὸς ἣν ἡ δύναμις αὐτοῦ ἦν; λέγω δὲ τὸ τοιόνδε· οἷον ἡ ἀκοή, φαμέν, οὐκ ἄλλου τινὸς ἦν ἀκοὴ ἢ φωνῆς· ἦ γάρ;
Ναί.
Οὐκοῦν εἴπερ αὐτὴ αὑτῆς ἀκούσεται, φωνὴν ἐχούσης ἑαυτῆς ἀκούσεται· οὐ γὰρ ἂν ἄλλως ἀκούσειεν.
Πολλὴ ἀνάγκη.
Καὶ ἡ ὄψις γέ που, ὦ ἄριστε, εἴπερ ὄψεται αὐτὴ ἑαυτήν, χρῶμά τι αὐτὴν ἀνάγκη ἔχειν· ἄχρων γὰρ ὄψις οὐδὲν [ἂν] 168e μή ποτε ἴδῃ.
Οὐ γὰρ οὖν.
Ὁρᾷς οὖν, ὦ Κριτία, ὅτι ὅσα διεληλύθαμεν, τὰ μὲν αὐτῶν ἀδύνατα παντάπασι φαίνεται ἡμῖν, τὰ δ’ ἀπιστεῖται σφόδρα μή ποτ’ ἂν τὴν ἑαυτῶν δύναμιν πρὸς ἑαυτὰ σχεῖν; μεγέθη μὲν γὰρ καὶ πλήθη καὶ τὰ τοιαῦτα παντάπασιν ἀδύνατον· ἢ οὐχί;
Πάνυ γε.
Ἀκοὴ δ’ αὖ καὶ ὄψις καὶ ἔτι γε κίνησις αὐτὴ ἑαυτὴν κινεῖν, καὶ θερμότης κάειν, καὶ πάντα αὖ τὰ τοιαῦτα τοῖς 169a μὲν ἀπιστίαν ⟨ἂν⟩ παράσχοι, ἴσως δέ τισιν οὔ. μεγάλου δή τινος, ὦ φίλε, ἀνδρὸς δεῖ, ὅστις τοῦτο κατὰ πάντων ἱκανῶς
Charmides
p. 51“Absolutely necessary, Socrates,” he said.
“And again, if something is double both of the other doubles and of itself, then it would presumably be double of itself and of the others as of halves; for there is no double of anything but a half.”
“True.”
“And what is more than itself will also be less, will it not, and what is heavier lighter, and what is older younger, 168d and so with everything else? Whatever has its own power in relation to itself, will it not also have the character toward which its power was directed?1 I mean something like this: hearing, we say, was the hearing of nothing but sound, wasn’t it?”
“Yes.”
“Then if hearing is to hear itself, it will hear itself as having a sound; for it could not hear otherwise.”
“Absolutely necessary.”
“And sight too, my excellent friend, if it is to see itself, must have some color; for sight will 168e never see anything that has no color.”
“No, it won’t.”
“So you see, Critias, that of the cases we have gone through, some appear to us to be altogether impossible, while others are very strongly doubted ever to have their own power in relation to themselves? For with magnitudes and numbers and such things it is altogether impossible, isn’t it?”
“Certainly.”
“Again, hearing and sight, and indeed motion moving itself and heat burning itself, and all such things, 169a would raise disbelief in some people, though perhaps not in others.2 It needs a great man, my friend, to determine this adequately for all cases:
Socrates
Reading Charmides · Charmides · 168c–169a
Ask about a concept, passage, contradiction, or connection.
Socrates will begin with this book and its sources.About This Reading Edition
Socrates, Charmides, and Critias examine temperance, self-knowledge, and the knowledge of knowledge. The complete dialogue appears in Ancient Greek and English, aligned by the supplied edition’s facing pages and Stephanus references.
Historical Text and Translation
Greek: Plato, Charmides, in J. Burnet, ed., Platonis Opera, volume III (Oxford: Clarendon Press, 1903), transcribed by the Perseus Digital Library, Tufts University. The supplied edition omits words marked for deletion, retains supplied words, lightly normalizes punctuation and paragraphing, and removes a stray digital numeral at 163c. The digital Greek transcription and its modifications are provided under CC BY-SA 4.0, with attribution to the Perseus Digital Library, Tufts University.
About Diotimos Editions
Diotimos Editions prepared this independently worded English translation in house. It aims for clear, measured English while preserving Plato’s conversational rhythm, philosophical distinctions, and the unfolding give-and-take of Socratic inquiry.
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Plato's Greek source work is in the public domain. The 2026 English translation and Diotimos editorial matter are original to this edition and remain © 2026 Diotimos.