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Plato

The Lovers

Ancient Greek with an independent English translation.

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The LoversThe Lovers · 137c–137e

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The Lovers · 137c–137e

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Ancient Greek

p. 20

ὀρθῶς, ἡ αὐτὴ δὲ καὶ γιγνώσκει τοὺς χρηστοὺς καὶ τοὺς μοχθηρούς, ἢ ἑτέρα τις;

Ἡ αὐτή, ἔφη.

Ἐθελήσεις οὖν καὶ κατ’ ἀνθρώπους τοῦτο ὁμολογεῖν, 137d ἥπερ βελτίστους ἀνθρώπους ποιεῖ, ταύτην εἶναι καὶ τὴν κολάζουσαν ὀρθῶς καὶ διαγιγνώσκουσαν τοὺς χρηστούς τε καὶ μοχθηρούς;

Πάνυ γ’, ἔφη.

Οὐκοῦν καὶ ἥτις ἕνα, καὶ πολλούς, καὶ ἥτις πολλούς, καὶ ἕνα;

Ναί.

Καὶ καθ’ ἵππων δὴ καὶ τῶν ἄλλων ἁπάντων οὕτως;

Φημί.

Τίς οὖν ἐστιν ἡ ἐπιστήμη, ἥτις τοὺς ἐν ταῖς πόλεσιν ἀκολασταίνοντας καὶ παρανομοῦντας ὀρθῶς κολάζει; οὐχ ἡ δικαστική;

Ναί.

Ἦ ἄλλην οὖν τινα καλεῖς καὶ δικαιοσύνην ἢ ταύτην;

Οὐκ, ἀλλὰ ταύτην.

137eΟὐκοῦν ᾗπερ κολάζουσιν ὀρθῶς, ταύτῃ καὶ γιγνώσκουσι τοὺς χρηστοὺς καὶ μοχθηρούς;

Ταύτῃ.

Ὅστις δὲ ἕνα γιγνώσκει, καὶ πολλοὺς γνώσεται;

Ναί.

Καὶ ὅστις γε πολλοὺς ἀγνοεῖ, καὶ ἕνα;

Φημί.

Εἰ ἄρα ἵππος ὢν ἀγνοοῖ τοὺς χρηστοὺς καὶ πονηροὺς ἵππους, κἂν ἑαυτὸν ἀγνοοῖ ποῖός τίς ἐστιν;

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The Lovers

p. 21

them rightly—is it also the same one that knows the decent and the worthless, or another?”1

“The same,” he said.

“Then will you be willing to agree to this in the case of men too: 137d that the craft that makes men best is also the one that punishes them rightly and distinguishes the decent and the worthless?”

“Certainly,” he said.

“Then also the one that does so for one does so for many too, and the one that does so for many, for one too?”

“Yes.”

“And so too in the case of horses and of everything else?”

“I say so.”

“What, then, is the knowledge that rightly punishes those in cities who are unruly and break the law? Is it not the judge’s?”2

“Yes.”

“Is it, then, some other than this one that you call justice too?”

“No, but this one.”

137e“Then by the very thing by which they punish rightly, by that they also know the decent and the worthless?”

“By that.”

“And whoever knows one will also know many?”

“Yes.”

“And whoever is ignorant of many, of one as well?”

“I say so.”

“Then if one who is a horse were ignorant of the decent and base horses, would he also be ignorant of himself, of what sort he is?”3

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About This Reading Edition

Socrates recalls a debate between two rival lovers about what philosophy is: much learning, a knowledge of many crafts, or the knowledge by which we know ourselves and judge rightly. This complete edition presents the dialogue, 132a–139a, across thirteen Greek–English page pairs, with an introduction, Key Words of the Dialogue, an outline, glossary, critical apparatus, and thirty translator’s notes. The dialogue is transmitted among Plato’s works; its authorship remains disputed.

Discussion Questions

Historical Text and Translation

The Greek follows John Burnet’s Platonis Opera, volume II (Oxford, 1901; second edition, 1910), in a later Oxford impression printed by John Johnson. The supplied edition checks the Perseus Digital Library transcription against the printed pages and retains Burnet’s paragraphing, verse, editorial signs, and critical apparatus. The supplied PDF preserves the complete printed layout.

About Diotimos Editions

Diotimos Editions prepared this independent English translation directly from the Greek. Socrates’ narration, the rival lovers’ exchanges, and the distinctions between learning, craft, usefulness, justice, and temperance remain aligned with the Greek. All thirty translator’s notes accompany their passages. The introduction and Key Words of the Dialogue precede the text; the Outline, Editorial Note, Glossary of Key Terms, and Note on this Edition follow it.

Rights

The ancient Greek work and Burnet’s printed edition are in the public domain. The Perseus digital Greek transcription and its modifications are attributed to the Perseus Digital Library, Tufts University, and reused under CC BY-SA 4.0. The independent English translation and Diotimos editorial matter are © 2026 Diotimos Editions.