Alcibiades II

Name: Alcibiades II
Author: Plato

Ancient Greek with an independent English translation.

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Alcibiades IIAlcibiades II · 142c–143b

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Alcibiades II · 142c–143b

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Ancient Greek

p. 16

ἂν ἢ διδομένων ἀπόσχοιτο ἢ μέλλων δι’ εὐχῆς τεύξεσθαι παύσαιτο ἂν εὐχόμενος· οἱ δὲ πολλοὶ οὔτε ἂν τυραννίδος διδομένης ἀπόσχοιντο ἂν οὔτε στρατηγίας οὐδ’ ἑτέρων 142d πολλῶν, ἃ παρόντα βλάπτει μᾶλλον ἢ ὠφελεῖ, ἀλλὰ κἂν εὔξαιντο ἂν γενέσθαι, εἴ τῳ μὴ παρόντα τυγχάνει· ὀλίγον δὲ ἐπισχόντες ἐνίοτε παλινῳδοῦσιν, ἀνευχόμενοι ἅττ’ ἂν τὸ πρῶτον εὔξωνται. ἐγὼ μὲν οὖν ἀπορῶ μὴ ὡς ἀληθῶς μάτην θεοὺς ἄνθρωποι αἰτιῶνται, ἐξ ἐκείνων φάμενοι κακά σφισιν εἶναι· οἱ δὲ καὶ αὐτοὶ σφῇσιν εἴτε ἀτασθαλίαισιν εἴτε ἀφροσύναις χρὴ εἰπεῖν, ὑπὲρ μόρον 142e ἄλγε’ ἔχουσι. κινδυνεύει γοῦν, ὦ Ἀλκιβιάδη, φρόνιμός τις εἶναι ἐκεῖνος ὁ ποιητής, ὃς δοκεῖ μοι φίλοις ἀνοήτοις τισὶ χρησάμενος, ὁρῶν αὐτοὺς καὶ πράττοντας καὶ εὐχομένους ἅπερ οὐ βέλτιον ἦν, ἐκείνοις δὲ ἐδόκει, κοινῇ ὑπὲρ ἁπάντων αὐτῶν εὐχὴν ποιήσασθαι· λέγει δέ πως ὡδί—

143aΖεῦ βασιλεῦ, τὰ μὲν ἐσθλά, φησί, καὶ εὐχομένοις καὶ ἀνεύκτοιςἄμμι δίδου, τὰ δὲ δειλὰ καὶ εὐχομένοις ἀπαλέξειν

κελεύει. ἐμοὶ μὲν οὖν καλῶς δοκεῖ καὶ ἀσφαλῶς λέγειν ὁ ποιητής· σὺ δ’ εἴ τι ἐν νῷ ἔχεις πρὸς ταῦτα, μὴ σιώπα.

ΑΛ. Χαλεπόν, ὦ Σώκρατες, ἐστὶν ἀντιλέγειν πρὸς τὰ καλῶς εἰρημένα· ἐκεῖνο δ’ οὖν ἐννοῶ, ὅσων κακῶν αἰτία ἡ ἄγνοια τοῖς ἀνθρώποις, ὁπότε, ὡς ἔοικε, λελήθαμεν ἡμᾶς 143b αὐτοὺς διὰ ταύτην καὶ πράττοντες καὶ τό γε ἔσχατον εὐχόμενοι ἡμῖν αὐτοῖς τὰ κάκιστα. ὅπερ οὖν οὐδεὶς ἂν οἰηθείη, ἀλλὰ τοῦτό γε πᾶς ἂν οἴοιτο ἱκανὸς εἶναι, αὐτὸς αὑτῷ τὰ βέλτιστα εὔξασθαι, ἀλλ’ οὐ τὰ κάκιστα. τοῦτο μὲν γὰρ ὡς ἀληθῶς κατάρᾳ τινὶ ἀλλ’ οὐκ εὐχῇ ὅμοιον ἂν εἴη.

Alcibiades II

p. 17

would either keep from what is given or, when he was going to obtain it through prayer, would stop praying. The many would not keep from a tyranny if it were given, nor from a generalship, nor from 142d many other things which, when present, harm more than they benefit; rather, they would even pray for them to come about, if they are in fact not present for someone. But after waiting a little they sometimes sing a palinode, unpraying whatever they prayed for at first.¹ For my part, then, I am at a loss: it may truly be in vain that men “blame” the gods, saying that their “bad things” come from them; “but they themselves too, by their own”—whether one should say “recklessness” or unintelligence—“142e have sorrows beyond their lot”.² It looks, at any rate, Alcibiades, as though that poet is an intelligent man, who, I think, having some senseless friends, and seeing them both doing and praying for what was not better, though it seemed so to them, made a prayer in common on behalf of them all. And he says it somehow like this:

143aKing Zeus, the good things, he says, both when we pray and when we pray not, give us; but the wretched things, even when we pray, ward off,

he bids.³ Now to me the poet seems to speak well and safely; but if there is anything in your mind to set against this, do not keep silent.

Alc. It is hard, Socrates, to speak against what has been well said. But this, at any rate, I take in: of how many bad things ignorance is the cause for men, since, as it seems, without noticing it we, 143b because of it, both do and, what is most extreme, pray for the worst things for ourselves.⁴ That is something no one would think; rather, this at least everyone would think he was good enough to do: to pray for the best things for himself, and not the worst. For that would truly be like some curse and not a prayer.

1.To sing a palinode (palinōidein) is to unsay in a second song what the first said, as the poet Stesichorus did of his song against Helen (Phaedrus 243a–b). Aneuchesthai, “to unpray”, is known to the lexicon only from this dialogue (here and 148b).

2.Zeus in the Odyssey (1.32–34): “Ah, how mortals blame the gods! For from us, they say, come bad things; but they themselves too, by their own recklessness, have sorrows beyond their lot.” Burnet spaces the poet’s words; “or unintelligence” is Socrates’ own.

3.The couplet is also in the Greek Anthology (10.108), without its author’s name, and in Proclus’ commentary on the Republic, which quotes this passage; both have lygra, “the baneful things”. Burnet prints Buttmann’s deila, “the wretched things”; the manuscripts of Plato have deina, “the dreadful things” (apparatus a3).

4.So Burnet, with hosōn kakōn, a correction in the Coislinianus 155; B and T have hoson kakon, “how great a bad thing” (apparatus a7).

About This Reading Edition

Socrates and Alcibiades examine prayer, ignorance, and the knowledge of what is best. Their inquiry asks whether receiving what we desire can harm us when we do not know what is good. This complete revised edition presents the dialogue, 138a–151c, across twenty-one Greek–English page pairs, with an introduction, Key Words of the Dialogue, an outline, glossary, critical apparatus, and translator’s notes. The dialogue is transmitted among Plato’s works; its authorship remains disputed.

Discussion Questions

Historical Text and Translation

The Greek follows John Burnet’s Platonis Opera, volume II (Oxford, 1901), in a later Oxford impression printed by John Johnson and published by Humphrey Milford. The words were taken from the Perseus Digital Library transcription and checked against the supplied printed pages. Burnet’s lineation, verse quotations, and critical apparatus are retained. The supplied PDF preserves the complete printed layout.

About Diotimos Editions

Diotimos Editions prepared and revised this independent English translation directly from the Greek, preserving the argument’s distinctions and the vocabulary of prayer and ritual. Each English dialogue page translates the Greek page opposite it. Translator’s notes accompany their passages. The introduction and Key Words of the Dialogue precede the text; the Outline, Editorial Note, Glossary of Key Terms, and Note on this Edition follow it. Introductory and concluding matter reflows for the screen.

Rights

The ancient Greek work and Burnet’s printed edition are in the public domain. The Perseus digital Greek transcription and its modifications are attributed to the Perseus Digital Library, Tufts University, and reused under CC BY-SA 4.0. The independent English translation and Diotimos editorial matter are © 2026 Diotimos Editions.